358 norma magnum vs 35 whelen

As it turned out, having a great punch was not enough for either one. I have built all 3 several times for various customers and owned both the 358 Norma and the 9.3X62. 358 Norma runs 250gr partitions at 2810 with Norma 204 powder. The case capacity of the .350 Rigby is very similar to that of the .358 Norma Magnum, and the performance is likewise similar. Throw a belt on the .35 Newton and you couldnt tell the difference three feet away. Released in 1959though there were no factory chambered rifles or factory loaded ammunition available for the new cartridgeNorma offered chamber reamers and new component brass for its new brainchild. The 6.5mm Creedmoor and the old 6.5x55 are sound minimal choices, adequate to 300 yards. Today, rifles can be made very light, but that can also be overdone because light rifles are whippy and hard to control when youre out of breath and have to settle in for a quick shot. was initially chambered in Remingtons Model 8 autoloader, soon followed by the Model 14 pump-action. Thier wouldn't be any action mods required to do the Whelen,just rebarrel and enjoy. Theres more to success than merely landing a good one on the chin. An elk is bigger than anything most deer hunters have encountered, but theres still a variance; a cow for the freezer isnt much bigger than a very large deer, but a mature bull elk is different. The bullet went in behind the near shoulder, struck the far shoulder from the inside, and the blue bull hit the ground with a thud. I am not into the current long-range fad, especially on powerful animals like elk. I would also expect it to handle anything in North America from deer to the big bears. Heres how to avoid the poseurs and choose the right one. Thats a question I just dont understand. I wont go so far as to say thats foolish, but theres a major difference in size and toughness between a cow or spike and a mature bull. .500 Nitro Express. This is in sharp contrast to the overwhelming success of the .357/9mm handgun cartridges, whose popularity dates right to the beginning of the self-contained cartridge era. What keeps it alive? We've got you covered. .22 LR7mm-08 Remington8mm Remington Magnum.338 Federal.224 Valkyrie.338-06 A-Square9.3x62mm Mauser.257 Weatherby Magnum.45-70 Government.300 H&H Magnum.25-06 Remington.30-06 Springfield6.5 Creedmoor.300 Remington Ultra Magnum7mm Remington Magnum.470 Nitro Express.280 Remington.300 Winchester Magnum.270 Winchester.222 Remington.45 ACP.404 Jeffery.44 Remington Magnum.41 Remington Magnum.243 Winchester.338 Winchester Magnum.357 S&W Magnum6.5-284 Norma8x57 Mauser.38 Smith & Wesson Special7x57mm Mauser9 mm Luger.35 Whelen.454 Casull.375 H&H Magnum.45 Colt.22-250 Remington10mm Auto.308 Winchester. Three rivals: (1) .338 Winchester Magnum, (2) .358 Norma Magnum and (3) .375 H&H. In both cartridges, versatility is limited more by the narrow range of bullets available than by any other factor. They truly were ahead of their time, as they were short magnums back when being a short magnum wasnt cool. As it was released in the first century of the . A monster buck is different from a fork-horn or a fat doe. Contributor Brad Fenson takes to the grill, to cook up some delicious venison burgers. Petersen's HUNTING Publisher, Kevin Steele is in the CZ booth with Dylan Rice at SHOT Show to talk about CZ 600 Series Trail rifle. Shorter and more common than the magnum-length receiver needed for the .375 and .300 Holland & Holland Magnum, the Winchester Model 70s and Remington Model 721s gave a new level of performance when chambered for the new magnums. The Newton was supposedly loaded, by Western Cartridge, to 2,975 fps with a 250-grain bullet, but I, for one, would want to see the chronograph reading. With such a wide range of both cast and jacketed bullets available, and todays variety in powders, the .358 Norma has an embarrassment of riches when it comes to load possibilities. The full spectrum of our many 7mms, from 7mm-08 and 7x57 on up to the fastest 7mm magnums, are also fine, but they are not magical giant-slayers. But in those countries where the lighter cartridges are legal for the cats, the .350 Rigby Magnum is just about perfect. The cartridge would be championed by Denys Finch Hatton (of Out of Africa fame), John Pondoro Taylor and Pete Pearson, and would be used by Baron Bror von Blixen-Fineke as well. To reach the .300 mark, youd need a 270-grain bullet (the North Fork and Woodleigh bullets come immediately to mind), but stabilization becomes an issue in the slower twists, and thats long been a problem in .35-caliber barrels. Kali Parmley of Gun Dog Magazine talks to George Thompson from Benelli USA about the new features from the Benelli line in 2023. With a 200-grain bullet the .35 Whelen actually shoots a bit flatter than the .30-06 Sprg. So while some of my rifle choices may have been oddball, none of the rifles Ive used for elk have been exactly wrong. Elk bullets must be tough enough to provide adequate penetration. The classic .350 Rigby Magnum load pushes a .358-inch diameter 225-grain bullet to a muzzle velocity of 2625 fps for 3,440 ft.-lbs. Can this be made into a .358 Norma Mag or must I do a .35 Whelen. The most popular cartridges for hunting and even target shooting begin and end with the thirties. On the other hand, you must hit it well, because if poorly hit, an elk shows strength and stamina and may cover many miles of tough country. He, too, could have been one of the greats. Shortening the 2.85-inches long .375 H&H case wasnt exactly a revolutionary ideathat little-known .275 H&H so closely resembles the design of the half-century younger 7mm Remington Magnum that its uncannybut with the Winchester marketing machine the concept was brought to the forefront. The .35 Whelen fires a larger .358 bullet and is therefore right at the cusp of being a big game caliber and is capable of handling everything except . Winchester still offers ammunition, but the guns are history. The Swedish firm of A.B. With the best loads, my Remington Model 700 is one-hole accurate. The .35's are just plain superior for CXP3 class game. Here are the features to watch out for. Meanwhile, the .358 Norma fizzled, for lack of a better term, because rifles were not readily available, ammunition was expensive and hard to get, and it found itself in direct competition with one of the great American cartridges of the twentieth century, Winchesters .338 Magnum. in an 8.5 pound rifle, is comparable to the much more popular but less effective (on CXP3 class game) .300 Weatherby or .300 Remington Ultra Magnums. was designed for the American market, but sadly no American riflemaker ever chambered the cartridge in a cataloged gun. I had the privilege of spending some time with a 1917 vintage take-down Rigby-Mauser rifle while on a hunt in Scotland, and the words sweet shooting came quickly to mind. As Ive said, I like mediums, such as the unpopular 8mm Remington Magnum and the faster .33s. Bottles & 12-oz. Too bad Ingemar Johansson was not so well equipped. Make no mistake, the .30-06 is a powerful cartridge, but it doesnt beat you to death and can be built in the seven- to eight-pound range. were to go head to head with the .25-35 Win., .30-30 Win. Griffin & Howe developed the semiwildcat .350 G&H based on the .375 H&H case, as well as pioneering the .35 Whelen. I believe it never will. Every time I use it I ask myself, Whats not to like? Beats me, but nobody liked it enough to keep it in production. The first time I ever hunted with a .358 Norma Magnum, it was a custom rifle built on a Mauser Mark X action. The .270 WSM and .270 Weatherby deliver more energy, but all three are fine. In its 112-year lineage, it has probably taken more elk than all other cartridges combined. Sometimes you get a point-blank shot; other times you need to stretch it a bit farther. is a wonderful cartridge, but nobody buys them. Also, the 35 Whelen will not do much that your 350 and 358 already do, if anything. Also, many of these hunters have the luxury of a long season close to home. Lyman lists 47 different moulds that were available at one time or another, ranging in bullet weight from 70 to 282 grains. To get started, click the link below to visit mymagnow.com and learn how to access your digital magazine. As it stands, it is most certainly on the edge of becoming obsolete. Copyright 2003, 2012 by Chuck Hawks. Not necessarily top dollar everything. Its a great gun for moose and elk, bear and boar, and for bison as well. The .35 Whelen is a powerful medium-bore rifle cartridge that does not require a magnum action or a magnum bolt-face. In 1968 the 600 Magnum was replaced by the Model 660 Magnum, which featured a 20-inch barrel, but it was never a big seller, and Remington dropped the rifles. The .35 Caliber Cartridge Family(.357 Mag., .35 Remington, .356 Winchester, .358 Winchester, .35 Whelen, .350 Rem. Synthetic stocks arent always lighter than wood, but they are stronger and more stable, and elk hunting can be hard on rifles. And with modern powders and loads, it knocks on the door of the .300 WSM and .300 Winchester Magnum. At the same time, it will do almost everything the .375 will but with vastly more versatility. Quite a difference! of energy at the muzzle. Think of the .358 Norma Magnum as the chunky cousin of the .338 Winchester Magnum; not quite as svelte or popular, but equally effective in a fight. But perhaps youre not after thick-skinned dangerous game. The numerous magnum .30s are also excellent, but they deliver more recoil. G. Joined: Sep 2009. Recoil was completely manageable, and it inspired me to begin the journey of having my own .350 Rigby rifle built. Kevin Steele from Petersen's HUNTING speaks to Jordan Egli of Burris Optics about the all-new Veracity PH Riflescope. Powered by UBB.threads PHP Forum Software 7.7.5. Is there a way to find out what year it is by serial #? The 600 Magnum suffered from a barrel that was too short at 18 inches. I have used the .35 Whelen on critters from bobcats to moose. Blocker Outdoors Finisher gloves, headcovers and other accessories are available in Mossy Oak Bottomland and Mossy Oak Obsession NWTF camouflage patterns to match various turkey hunting terrain. Cartridges of .25 caliber and below are not ideal elk cartridges, especially if a big bull is a potential. Most were intended for .38-caliber handguns, but any bullet made for either the .38 Special or .357 Magnum can be loaded and shot in the .358 Norma Magnum with varying degrees of success. So if you have a .375 (or larger) and a yen to take it elk hunting, be my guest. Thanks for any thoughts. But they are not essential, and despite their effectiveness, all magnums from .30 caliber upwards generate more recoil than many folks are comfortable withand are able to shoot well. Moderate, safe, bland and predictable. There are places where .22 centerfires are legal for elk. Essentially a .338 Magnum with a bigger mouth, the .358 Norma can push 250-grain bullets faster. Any desire to hunt African dangerous game with your medium bore? 2023 Outdoor Sportsman Group. An earlier Western Cartridge load delivered 2,660 fps, which I suspect is closer to the truth. I think Jack OConnor, the great champion of the .270, would agree. The .308 Winchester is a fine elk cartridge, and the grand old .30-06, with a bit more velocity and energy, is better. It was verry expensive to shoot, lots of powder and expensive bullets and brass. Publisher, Kevin Steele is with Brett Marquardt from Streamlight Inc. discussing the new Streamlight Pro Tac 2.0, the latest edition in the Pro Tac series. Mag. It put an exclamation point on that lung shot. zero-we see that contrary to popular belief, a 35-caliber can be a long-range cartridge. The writings of Robert Ruark certainly helped the reputation of the cartridge and the company, as Ruark put his young PH Harry Selby and the .416 Rigby rifle he carried on a pedestal. Perhaps, if the word gets out to the shooting public, the born again .350 may finally achieve the commercial success it deserves. Mag. necked up to .35 caliber. in its NoslerCustom line with a 225-grain Partition bullet at 2550 f.p.s. In the mid 70's I picked up a 358Norma. Equal in importance is that you can hit the elk. If you match the bullet to the game, this is one of the all-time great hunting cartridges. But there is no compelling reason to consider a caliber larger than .35. But starting in the late 1950s, the .338 bore size gained considerable tractionthanks to the emergence of the .338 Winchester Magnum. Publisher Kevin Steele is in the Beretta booth with Logan Killam, the Shotgun Product Manager, to discuss the all new Beretta A300 Ultima Turkey. By coincidence, in that same year, Norma Projektilfabrik of Sweden introduced its own heavyweight champion, the .358 Norma Magnum. While most of the .35 caliber rifle cartridges are powerful medium bore numbers designed for use on large (CXP3) game like elk and moose, the most popular .35 caliber rifle cartridge is the .35 Remington. It was an 03 Springfield action, unknown barrel, very nice piece of wood, all the fancy metal work done (custom trigger, side safety ala Rem 700, cocking knob and safety removed, milled floorplate, forged bolt, speedloader slots removed, D&T'd ,polished and blued). Now, I have to go out on a limb and say that sensible elk cartridges arent all about power. The .350 Remington Magnum is the only cartridge that appears on both lists of current and obsolete calibers. The quest for an acceptable .35 has inspired such impotent wastes as the .35 Winchester Self Loader, once labeled a candidate for the title: Worlds Most Useless Center-Fire Rifle Cartridge.. The body of the .350 Magnum measures 0.517 inches at the base, smaller than the 0.589-inch base of the .416 Rigby. As an experiment, I shot the nilgai five or six more times with different bullets, then hauled the carcass back to the cleaning station intact and carried out a necropsy. First, it will do everything the .338 will, and a bit more. This is basically a deer and black bear (CXP2 class game) cartridge, although it is reputed to be superior to cartridges in the .30-30 class for game weighing over about 400 pounds. My 8mm Remington Magnum was stocked in dense walnut and had a long barrel. We owe a debt of gratitude to the engineers at the British firm of Holland & Holland; though it is lost to history who exactly designed the belted magnum cartridge, the .275 and .375 Holland & Holland Magnums were game changers. Heres a detailed look at each step of the process. And those sentiments can be an awful lot of fun. Copyright 2000-2023 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved. There is certainly no lack of .358-inch diameter bullets to choose from but brass is limited. and .35 Rem., it was an excellent woods rifle for hunting whitetails. I say that because so many reasonably successful yet hard kicking cartridges have been introduced in the last few years. From limited experience of loading for two different 358 Norma Magnum rifles (a Schultz & Larson Model 65 and a Custom Sako AV) I used to neck up new Winchester 338 Win. At 300 yds., the .358 Norma impacts only 0.96" lower than the .300 Win. The parent of this cartridge is the .30-06 Springfield, which is necked-up to accept a bullet diameter of .358 in (9.1 mm).This cartridge is more powerful than its parent, especially in killing power on large game. Posts: 46,063. However, that may be changing, or at least the possibility of change may exist. Back in 1983 Winchester introduced the .356 Win. It never got up. from my E.R. of muzzle energy. Norma loads their 250-grain Oryx bullet to this velocity, and as the rear portion of the bullet is bonded, it will give an excellent blend of expansion and penetration. Its a decent cartridge, but American hunters just wont flock to it. Its still a fine choice, but I dont have a .338 right now. 200-grain bullet to almost 2500 f.p.s. 358 norma mag is a rarer bird but as I understand fire forming 300 win mag brass an easy way to feed it. Most Professional Hunters agree that a bullet with a S.D. One can almost hear the echoes of Norma Mag. of muzzle energy. Does the power of the magnum offer much over the whelen in real life terms? Elk hunting can be extremely physicalnot only steep country, but also altitude and sometimes deep snow to buck. When chambered for cartridges such as the .243 Win., 6 mm Rem., .308 Win. a good brush buster and good to 300 yards. compare 338/06 vs 338 win, and 35 whelen vs 358 norma vs 358 alaskan (stw) loaded to same pressure. ), but with considerably less recoil. loaded with a 180-grain Oryx bullet to the .358 Norma Mag. Then come the .270s. I did secure properly head stamped Norma cases thinking we'd need them going over into the Yukon (no one ever checked). As unmagical as that might sound, it's one of the hardest hitting non-magnum cartridges ever. Remington currently lists a Model 7 rifle with a 20-inch barrel; todays version of the 600 in .350 Rem. The .300 Rem. Cartridges that in many cases cannot match the killing power, at normal hunting ranges, of comparable .35's. Sadly, my favorite bullet diameter, the .35 caliber, doesnt even rate a blip on the American shooters radar screen. As a comparison, the .358 Winchester with a 250 grain bullet at 2300 fps delivers 25.4 foot-pounds of recoil from a 7.5 pound rifle. This standard (.30-06) length magnum cartridge drives a 250 grain bullet at a muzzle velocity (MV) of 2799 fps with 4350 ft. lbs. in an 8.5 pound rifle, is comparable to the much more popular but less effective (on CXP3 class game) .300 Weatherby or .300 Remington Ultra Magnums. As many hunters know, the Remington Model 600 carbine, which was introduced in 1964, was one of the first short, light, bolt-action rifles to find success with deer hunters. So are the .350 Remington Magnum and .358 Norma Magnum.

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